I recommend you parents and grandparents look into what is entailed in a deferment on the basis of conscientious objection. I did.

Ruth

On the other hand, if there WAS a draft, we would no longer be in Iraq.

if there WAS a draft, we would no longer be in Iraq.

I have heard this silliness before. The Reptilicans behind the Rethuglicans are smarter this time around than in Viet Nam.

Despite all assurances to the contrary, who gets drafted this time around? It won't be the Young Republicans.

It will be blacks, Mexicans, and poor whites. It will be overtly Democratic or atheist kids naive enough to let it be known. It will be any prisoners younger than 42 and of color. The white supramicists from the trailer parks will be your noncom officers, and the Christian fundies your brass.

You get the job of clearing Basra of all opposition. In 120 degree heat. With body armor that doesn't work. Against insurgents armed with AK-47s made in China, bought by the Pentagon, and issued to Sunnis and Shiites- both sides- the week before.

Like that uranium dust you're breathing?

We are in Iraq, soon to be Iran and Syria too, for the rest of your life, which won't be long if you let yourself be drafted. There is only a limited amount of oil in the world, Cheneyburton and the Saudis won't allow alternatives to be developed, and the banker that's mortgaged your house, car, and soul needs a tank of gas for his Hummer.

Praise the Lord!

No Hell below us
Above us, only sky

What you describe, kelley b, is what happened in Vietnam. Young Republicans didn't get drafted. Minorities, poor whites and malcontents did. And if the powers-that-be try it again, the same thing's going to happen again. The white supremacists noncoms will get scragged in the field, and the US will get its ass handed to it.

BushCo will send in the air force and turn Iraq/Iran/Syria into glassed-over parking lots before they reinstate the draft.

Military service isn't very much fun, so when the nation needs it, it's perfectly fine for it to call a draft. Of course, it doesn't need it -- it can cancel the war instead. But there's no reason NOT to consider the draft. The draft has been waved in our faces by the whole blogosphere as the scaaaaary part of the war, but the scary part isn't that it's being considered but that it's being mentioned. Of course it's being considered! And the consequences have also been considered, and that's as far as it went. It's like negotiations with Iran -- nothing is off the table. That's as it should be. The difference between us and the neocons is that they're much more willing to actually use what's on the table than we are. Of course we shouldn't categorically declare that we won't nuke Iran, because God forbid there may actually be a genuine need for killing hundreds of thousands of regular people who happened to live (well, not anymore) in the wrong province of Iran. However, for us progressives, the nuclear option is a last resort, after the "becoming an Islamic theocratic state subject to Iran" fails, whereas for neocons it comes before the "holding diplomatic conversations" option.

I find it ironic that the attack is on considering something on a show called "All Things Considered". '“I think it makes sense to certainly consider it,” Army Lt. Gen. Douglas Lute said in an interview with National Public Radio’s “All Things Considered.”' Of course we should consider it -- we're considering EVERYTHING! So essentially, I think we're talking about misplaced outrage on the parts of many in the blogosphere. The situation hasn't changed. The draft isn't more likely now than it was before. There was always the option for a draft -- Dick Cheney may be evil, but he isn't stupid. He knows what happened in Vietnam -- conscription -- and what happens in many other countries including Israel. Nobody in the planning rooms of this stupid war has been unaware of the possibility of forcibly swelling the ranks, but the effects are too horrible to actually implement.

I remember back when the idea to fix things was to build an international coalition, back in the 2004 elections. Why isn't that option still on the table? Oh, yeah, because nobody else is stupid enough to enter this, to use the words of Dick Cheney, quagmire.

A draft means an army of slaves.

You think this will make popular opposition to the war materialize? There are hundreds of thousands of private contractors associated with this war, and possibly millions of Americans making a lot of money off it. They have tools of a police state nobody except George Orwell and Phillip K. Dick ever dreamed about when I was a teenager fighting against the Viet Nam war.

You think this draft will be any different than Viet Nam's? You think it will be fairer? You are deluding yourself. It will be far worse, far more unjust, and far more unfair.

And you will hear nothing of injustice from the main$tream media. Likely by the time the draft is fully in swing the blogsphere will be totally marginalized due to the corporatization of the internet.

The new draft may target people into their late 30s. The new draft may involve conscription of men and women for "public service". The new draft will be like nothing you've ever seen, because it will be constructed to fight a war for oil for the next 50 years in an increasingly policed state.

You think this is all tinfoil rattle? Place your trust in your leaders, don't rock the boat, and watch where it takes you.

No Hell below us
Above us, only sky

If there is a draft, the best-case scenario is that it'll be as unfair as the Vietnam draft. Most likely -- as you predict -- it would be far worse.

The big question is how sheeple-y the public will be about a draft for a war that's already so unpopular and so commonly known to be unnecessary and ill-conceived.

We could pretty quickly get into "Hell no, we won't go" action in the streets, and a lot of parents will be in the thick of it.

but I encounter too many left of center people in the Medical Center where I work who think a draft- and an authoritarian "liberal" president- is exactly what we need.

Madness, that is. If I respond too vigorously, please accept my apologies.

No Hell below us
Above us, only sky

The draft+authoritarian liberal president "solution" would be madness, indeed. I haven't personally encountered that kind of talk, but it would get me rather prickly, too.

to me, honestly, i don't see how we can avoid it. in the sense that i'm not sure how they are going to get future generations to pay for all the things we've borrowed to have today. they're doing pretty good forcing the poorest into service or near slavery, but they'll need to fully yoke the "middle class," whatever that looks like in 10 years, in order to satisfy our debtors.

peak oil is only going to get worse as well, and our leaders don't have the vision to imagine an environmentally self sustaining police state. so endless war. which will require a new army, very shortly. the one we have is very broken right now.

i think it could go terrorist attack -> new national service bill that covers more than just military service -> eventually making those conditions permanant in the name of economic and national "security." we'll see.