I followed xan’s link to Hecate’s post about a Twisty post. Then I went to ilykadamen- Occasionally Conversations with my man are Instructive to read her discussion on men who get upset (or even pissed off) at being lumped in with the mother rapers, and the father rapers, and all the other occupants of the W bench.

She says:

“No, I get that,” I interrupted him. “That’s a lot like—like, I used to have the same reaction reading blogs by people of color. I’d see something like ’white people sure suck sometimes,’ and I’d be all, ’Hey! Wait! Not all of us! Not me!’ Even though I probably do suck as a white person sometimes—but I mean, I’d take it too personally.”

…

“It’s not as hard if you move yourself out of the center of everything, though. That’s what I finally got through my thick skull. It’s not ABOUT me, always. And even if it is about me, so what? I’m not perfect. Why shouldn’t I have to take some shit once in awhile? Heaven knows I dish enough out in a day. Would it kill me to get an attitude adjustment? Would it kill me to listen to someone unlike me for five minutes?”

I struggle with the idea that we - that I -shouldn’t take it personally. I mean in one sense, taking it personally is stupid. But in another sense, if we don’t take it personally, then how are we to ever recognize when it DOES apply to us, personally?

The reality is that it is meant personally. When people use hate speech, even against the man, it IS personal. The being speaking feels the justice of his or her position, and the injustices done them, personally and wants the object of that hate speech to feel it the same way.

Serving up hate for hate is a lose/lose proposition. Maybe there is no other choice than to fight back with every possible weapon, but when you take a gun to a fight, it’s not always just the perps who get hurt.

ilykadamen continues on that the women posting hate speech don’t really hate men. At least not ALL men. And, well, some of them do hate all men, but not, like, the still sane ones, and the ones no longer sane were made that way by the man, so it’s not their fault.

Ok, everything after the first sentence immediately above is my extension of what ilyka said.

More from ilyka:

“If I’m not the problem,” I explained, “then why should I get invested in identifying with the problem? If the problem is some particular batch of white people, doing or saying shit I’d never in a million years do myself, why should I feel the need to put myself in their shoes? Just because they’re white and I’m white? That’s stupid. Like all the idiot white dudes who identify with the Duke lacrosse players—they don’t even comprehend that unless they’re just as wealthy and elite, which you know 95% of them aren’t, the fucking lacrosse players would SPIT on them. They’re ID-ing with the players, but I guarantee you the players aren’t ID-ing with them.”

I read the above to say, if you aren’t on the Rutgers football team, why should you get upset? Now before you say that it should read “if you aren’t Imus, why should you get upset?” but remember who is hating on who - the feminists who hate men (if there are any - maybe they just talk like they do), and the white man is the object of the hate speech - just like the Rutgers team was the object of Imus’ hate speech.

I compartmentalize when I read vitriol pointed at a cadre of which I am a part. I put those comments in a little box where I don’t have take ownership. That is the only way to deal with it, and it is in fact what ilyka recommends. But it is a sorry assed approach to living to separate out little parts of yourself so that you don’t have to deal. There is mucho emotional wellbeing to be had in NOT compartmentalizing. It is my belief that compartmentalizing is what allows otherwise good people to do terrible things.

So if I am less than perfect in compartmentalizing, and I sometimes take hate speech personally, well, as they say, man up. Don’t call me an evil fuck and then get all pissed off when I disagree.

Not that anyone has called me an evil fuck.

Lately, anyway.

It’s not different from being called a traitor because I despise what Bush has done, and would likely despise the man if I knew him. I just avoid reading people who speak to me in that way. In the same vein, I don’t read feminist blogs, except occasionally, because whatever good they might do me is lost in the invective I first have to wade through. Maybe that just makes me a pussy, I don’t know.

So I appreciate the feminists here at CW doing the wading for me. I count myself fortunate to read passionate and intelligent posts on feminist issues without necessarily feeling targetted by militant feminist rhetoric.

So, you feminist guys (guys is non-genderational), don’t hesitate to post more on feminist issues, and to put up more links. I am well aware that I am not fully house broke yet.

Jake