Just don't do it.
I don't give a flying damn about any kind of allegation that the color of his skin is an excuse for his behavior, and if you try to push that with me you damn well better understand you will fail. And if making dogs or roosters or other animals fight is okay in the entertainment fraction of your cultural milieu, then God help you see what a jerk you're being and help you stop supporting that kind of cruelty.

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!-- Xan

Help. Vick was convicted under a law passed after he committed what he pled guilty too? I'm baffled.

Incidentally, and on point, or off, I've noticed we've gotten a lot of hits that combine "Vick" and "nigger," and not, I think, in a good way. No hits on "Vick" and cruelty to animals, though.

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!—Xan

Help. Vick was convicted under a law passed after he committed what he pled guilty too? I’m baffled.

not exactly. I understand he was originally charged in April 2007 under the old statutes...as in:
Animal Fighting Prohibition Enforcement Act of 2005 (Introduced in Senate). The federal laws were then updated again in May 2007. The federal penalties for dogfighting he was charged with are misdemeanors, as I understand it, but they have also hit him with federal conspiracy charges (operating a continuing criminal enterprise). He'll have more problems if the state and local people continue to prosecute. Things could be a lot worse for him on the state and local level where the penalties are harsher.

*

Farmer I thought he was charged under this one:
HR 137/S 261—Animal Fighting Prohibition Enforcement Act of 2007 see here

"I don’t give a flying damn about any kind of allegation that the color of his skin is an excuse for his behavior"

And well you shouldn't! Especially since I never made such a claim.

"And if making dogs or roosters or other animals fight is okay in the entertainment fraction of your cultural milieu, then God help you see what a jerk you’re being and help you stop supporting that kind of cruelty."

And no I don't particularly find much pleasure in dogfights. But I have no problem with them. I have no problem with animal sacrifice and neither does my god, or yours if your a Christian, Muslim or Jew.

I don't consider it cruel. It’s simply reality. Death is certain, Life is not. If you lose you die.

However, I do see the racial component of the whole show trial.

I do think it absurd that an animal, a piece of property, is being equated and endowed with autonomous rights as if it were a person or citizen. I don't believe domesticated animals should "have" rights. I realize that under the laws of this country they do.

I also realize that dog fighting is an easy behavior to criminalize. I also realize that the crime has been created to target a portion of the population that is less sheepish than the norm. I also realize that this is an extraordinary revenue generator. I realize Vick is a prime example. I realize that the second amendment has been destroyed even further, along with the fourth. But fuck it. The constitution doesn't mean much any way.

I realize that its frightening, and horrible and terrifying. I realize that there is a lot of sublimated and not so sublimated racism surrounding this whole thing. Particularly when it masquerades as rage and indignation.

All this for a dog? Between the government intervention into the urban drug trade and the destruction of the inner-cities, and millions of people destroyed for the sake of being tough on crime, I've seen too much to buy the bullshit.

We'll just have to disagree on this one.

“Of all the so-called savage beasts on Earth, surely man is most vile.”

Xenophon, no i don't think so. I checked out that wiki entry on him that you mentioned...followed some links and news articles on it and from what i could make of it - it says he was charged under the existing statutes at the time, pre May (which is why under the existing statutes at that time he was charged with misdemeanors for fighting animals). Although I'm not sure if the new statutes (May 2007 forward) are more severe (felonies) or not, they may be, he wasn't apparently charged under those. In any case, they loaded the federal conspiracy charges on too, (they apparently considsered RICO charges) The felony conspiracy charges would relate to the gambling, operation of a criminal enterprise across state lines (the kennel company and all that) etc...which is also what the other defendants were going to testify against him about.

So, as far as I can tell... he pled guilty to the pre-existing fed charges (the misdemeanors) as well as the fed conspiracy felony. But not anything after May 2007. At least thats how i understoond it.

*

Michael Vick admitted guilt.
There was no show trial.

Do you seriously wish to equate dogfighting with religion?

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!-- Xan

On one hand, I see Xeno's point about the racial component to the whole thing. I've been feeling it since the beginning of the excessive outrage. Everyone pointing fingers at the Bad Black Man and calling for him to be punished, punished, punished!

It's a question of perspective and narrative, I think. From the perspective of the black community (and I'm just guessing because I'm not a part of it) it's another instance of over-criminalizing behavior that is specific to black people.

Just one glaring example that still hasn't been corrected: the mandatory sentencing is disproportionally harsher for possession of crack compared to the penalty for the exact same quantity of powdered cocaine. What group is unfairly affected by this law to the tune of thousands of people in jail?

And you don't see felony charges for greyhound racing, or horse racing or polo for that matter. In these activities innocent animals are exploited, abused and disposed of. What is the difference between these and dog fighting?

I guess the difference is the way in which the "competition" takes place. Horse and dog racing involve "civilized" rituals and computerized betting, while dog fighting is raw, brutal and bloody.

This is the part where I see black folks willingly embodying the stereotypes that white culture has set up for them. Dog fighting is raw, brutal and bloody so it fits with the stereotype of the brutal, violent black man.

And this is where I think Michael Vick is a stupid m-f for choosing to maintain his self-image as a "real" black man by engaging in dog fighting. He was willing to risk all the good things he could have done for the community with his money and status just to maintain a thug image.

Dog fighting may be part of black urban culture but if that is all that it has to offer, and that is what people are taking a stand on, black culture is in a sorry, sorry state.

Also, nobody is going to be persuaded by the argument that "dogs are property" and therefore can be abused, exploited and destroyed as if they were inanimate objects.

A chair is property, a pet is something very different. People (even black people) love their pets, as if they were people.

The point that the media and masses of Americans seem to care more about pets than they do about poor and unfortunate (or just dark-skinned) humans is valid, though.

In the end, this will just be another episode of the media indirectly teasing racial tensions and visceral emotions (attachment to pets) for ratings and profit.

People will get more entrenched in their suspicion and dislike for each other while the Elites, very much united, will chuckle all the way to the racetrack.

I don’t consider it cruel. It’s simply reality. Death is certain, Life is not. If you lose you die.

Well, there ya go Xen. You said it. Guilt is certain, innocence is not. If you lose you go to jail. Surely you can appreciate that simple ironic reality. I'm sure your God would agree that such sacrificial gambles are appropriate.

*

Nope, I'm not buying the whole "race" deal that you are trying to make out of this.

Why?

Because I live in South Carolina where both dogs and cocks are fought by both low-class white people, and low-class black people. Never hear of either whites or blacks getting arrested, charged, or serving time.

We only just recently got some regulations passed on cockfighting during the same legislative session that refused to pass a more substantive legal penalty for men who beat their wives.

Dogfighting is covered under cruelty to animal laws.

Gambling on either is still illegal. Laws against gambling are not race specific.

Animal fighting is not a cultural thing or a racial thing, it is a cruel and an inhuman thing practiced by ignorant, heartless, and low class people.

Michael Vick is cruel, inhuman, ignorant, heartless and low-class, no matter how much money he makes or what race he may be.

He is also a criminal by his own admission.

Please explain to me again how he is being persecuted because of his race when he was facing being testified against by other black men, his friends and relatives, because he engaged in an activity that is illegal under federal and state statutes for all people regardless of race, but practiced by people of different races.

I call bullshit.

... I never brought this up in the Constitutional restoration thread:

Between the government intervention into the urban drug trade and the destruction of the inner-cities, and millions of people destroyed for the sake of being tough on crime, I’ve seen too much to buy the bullshit.

Obviously, we can't retain our putative status as a free people by jailing some insane percentage of black men, and then funding big parts of rural America by building prisons there to hold them. One is evil enough, and then the other makes a self-reinforcing cycle of it all.

Ick. Shame on me, I didn't want to get involved in the discussion. Animals, that's MJS's department. Racism, what is that? And besides, I don't have a TV, so the NFL isn't my thing, and I don't even know who Vick is.

Bit Corrente exists to make the kind of connection I failed to make. Regardless of whether I agree with Xen, and I don't think I do, I think it's great he makes his point clearly and forcefully, and stands his ground. So we progress, in tiny uneven steps.

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!—Xan

Sarah:
Do you seriously wish to equate dogfighting with religion?

Xeno:
“And no I don’t particularly find much pleasure in dogfights. But I have no problem with them. I have no problem with animal sacrifice and neither does my god, or yours if your a Christian, Muslim or Jew.”

Do I seriously wish to equate dog fighting with religion?

Not necessarily though, I wouldn’t exclude it. My actual intention was signal the coming argument that animal cruelty will be equated with animal sacrifice. Thereby creating a movement to ban animal sacrifice or criminalize it.

Where are you going with this, Xen?

Immigration + Santeria and a moral panic? Now that would be foily, but this is all new to me, so explicate, please.

(Since we're all going to die, all flesh is as grass, it's not killing the dogs that bugs me so much as making a spectacle of it, and a profit making venture, and what I see as torturing them before they go. Not a good death.)

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!—Xan

Dog fighting may be part of black urban culture but if that is all that it has to offer, and that is what people are taking a stand on, black culture is in a sorry, sorry state.

Also, nobody is going to be persuaded by the argument that “dogs are property” and therefore can be abused, exploited and destroyed as if they were inanimate objects.

A chair is property, a pet is something very different. People (even black people) love their pets, as if they were people.

First, Dog Fighting is not a part of “Black Urban Culture.” That is a conflation created by the media. The meme works something like this: Big Mean Dangerous Pit Bull = Big Mean Dangerous Black Male, the association is designed to forge a semantic link between (Pit Bull, Black Male, Drug Dealer, Dog Fighter, Monster).

Second, “Black Urban Culture” is a product for white suburban kids created by media companies and has very little to do with black culture or urban culture. It is, however, a part of American consumer culture which is primarily supported by white suburban youth (some estimates say 70% of financial support for the mythic “Black Urban Culture”).

Next: Dogs are property. It does not warrant their abuse. It simply means that their protection from abuse under the law should stand on their condition as property not persons.

Finally: “People (even black people) love their pets, as if they were people.”
Yes we all have a capacity for projection.

Well, there ya go Xen. You said it. Guilt is certain, innocence is not. If you lose you go to jail. Surely you can appreciate that simple ironic reality. I’m sure your God would agree that such sacrificial gambles are appropriate.

I think it(my god)would.

We live by the rules and die by the rules.
You fuck up, you're done.
Ride or die.

Working on correcting the sentencing confusion. Thank you.

As, I'm sure I don't need to remind anybody, humans were, and still are in some benighted parts of the world. (Then there's the issue of alienation of labor, but that's a whole separate thread).

Re "Black Urban Culture" the corporate "cultural" construct, I thought this was interesting:

Because I live in South Carolina where both dogs and cocks are fought by both low-class white people, and low-class black people. Never hear of either whites or blacks getting arrested, charged, or serving time.

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!—Xan

“Nope, I’m not buying the whole “race” deal that you are trying to make out of this.
Why?
Because I live in South Carolina where both dogs and cocks are fought by both low-class white people, and low-class black people. Never hear of either whites or blacks getting arrested, charged, or serving time.
Please explain to me again how he is being persecuted because of his race when he was facing being testified against by other black men, his friends and relatives, because he engaged in an activity that is illegal under federal and state statutes for all people regardless of race, but practiced by people of different races.”

Please explain to me again how he is being persecuted because of his race when he was facing being testified against by other black men, his friends and relatives, because he engaged in an activity that is illegal under federal and state statutes for all people regardless of race, but practiced by people of different races.

“He” is being prosecuted because “he” broke the law. The racial dimension is in its reporting and the construction and application of the law.

There is a pattern of association that is being established between dogfights and drug dealers. Why? Because the prison population will increase by 50% by 2025. KBR and Haliburton have spent tons of money creating new prison centers, the immigration situation is creating an atmosphere that says it is OK to use slave labor (prisoners) to do work that illegal aliens normally do. The prison industry is one of the fastest growing industries in the country. Their ability to supply labor is a chief profit center for them, which incentivizes the production of more prison facilities. The production of more prison facilities creates a demand for more prisoners. A demand for more prisoners creates a demand for more criminals.

How do we get more criminals? By making more things a crime.

African Americans are disproportionately represented in the prison population and disproportionately prosecuted in the criminal justice system relative to their numbers in the overall population of lawbreakers. Laws may be written for all but are not prosecuted equally nor, is sentencing color blind.

Michael Vick has no possibility of a fair trial, if the reaction on this blog is any indication of what a jury’s reaction might be. He had to plea. The media coverage simply prevented the possibility of a trial. It was tried in the media before it could ever go through the judicial process. The media has become jury and judge.

With that said. Now the narrative will turn to how out of control these NFL players are. All but a few will be Black. They will be portrayed as out of control thugs.

The American population has great difficulty separating that black man on TV from that black man in the elevator. Americans are often times unable to see beyond the stereotype presented on television. For most of America the only black people they see are Sports stars on television.

The stereotype has already been established, Black Men who look like Michael Vick are either into dog fighting or drug dealing. Therefore, they should be locked up. They are inhuman monsters who savagely destroy and brutalize poor defenseless animals. Lock them up!

This is America, you don’t have to “buy” the race thing. It’s pre-packaged in the American identity, the economy, and the constitution.

"Because I live in South Carolina where both dogs and cocks are fought by both low-class white people, and low-class black people. Never hear of either whites or blacks getting arrested, charged, or serving time."

The people I know in Georgia, Alabama, Mississippi, Louisiana, Texas and North Carolina who have participated in this are Doctors, Lawyers, Judges, Police Chiefs and vets. It was a generally accepted part of Southern Rural culture. Obviously it no longer is. Bu the class argument won’t hold water – not on empirical grounds, perhaps as a rhetorical flourish to an unarticulated moral position. Certainly not as a fact.

A lot of people are not Christian and aren’t Abrahamic. There has been a continuing push to outlaw animal sacrifice. It’s not just immigrants but it is primarily people from the African Diaspora and those of indigenous American descent. Their temples have been raided and desecrated in the name of Animal rights.

In this great thread - the strong, intelligent and passionate agruments can be boiled down into four levels regarding law and race:

1. Laws as enacted can have a disproportionate effect on a particular race:

Just one glaring example that still hasn’t been corrected: the mandatory sentencing is disproportionally harsher for possession of crack compared to the penalty for the exact same quantity of powdered cocaine. What group is unfairly affected by this law to the tune of thousands of people in jail?

2. Laws can be enforced disproportionately:

Obviously, we can’t retain our putative status as a free people by jailing some insane percentage of black men, and then funding big parts of rural America by building prisons there to hold them. One is evil enough, and then the other makes a self-reinforcing cycle of it all.

3. Defenses are available in proportion to one's wealth:

There is a long history of America systematically suppressing, through the terror of the legal system, violence and media, African American Men. This is a lynching. And they will come for you next (read -those who make less than 10 million (10,six zeros) dollars).

4. The media can exploit a case in racial terms:

This is the part where I see black folks willingly embodying the stereotypes that white culture has set up for them. Dog fighting is raw, brutal and bloody so it fits with the stereotype of the brutal, violent black man.

And this is where I think Michael Vick is a stupid m-f for choosing to maintain his self-image as a “real” black man by engaging in dog fighting. He was willing to risk all the good things he could have done for the community with his money and status just to maintain a thug image.

Dog fighting may be part of black urban culture but if that is all that it has to offer, and that is what people are taking a stand on, black culture is in a sorry, sorry state.

Yes, dogs are property. No, they don't have "rights" - in the sense that a dog cannot bring an action. However, we, United States citizens, have chosen to protect such "property" through certain laws.

These laws are not race specific - unless you buy into the media's portrayal of dog fighting as a particular races' endeavor.

It's enforcement is not race specific - consider prosecutions for cock fighting, other animal neglect, etc.

Michael Vick had the financial resources for a vigorous defense - and he pleaded guilty.

The only real way in which this whole narrative has any traction in a racial sense is through the media. Some in the media covered it because Vick is rich and famous - others covered it as an "urban problem" - i.e. minorties.

The Bill of Rights is a born rebel. It reeks with sedition. In every clause it shakes its fist in the face of constituted authority. . . . it is the one guaranty of human freedom to the American people. - Frank Irving Cobb

Santeria is very similar to Christianity in that it is a particular cult of a particular superstion, based in magical thinking.

If you look at Christianity from the same perspective what you see is ritualized cannibalism. Oh, yes, the more established churches have sanitized the ritual by substituting a wafer and wine (or in the churches with a more pronounced Temperance influence, bread and juice) for the flesh and blood of the man hanged upon a cross to die; but the symbolism -- and the Catholic clergy worked for centuries on how to explain this -- and the belief that in the instant of consumption this moiety of grain and fruit "transubstantiates" into flesh and blood again (and over the hundreds of millions of faithful who've received communion in the last 1900-plus years, if there were an atom of flesh and blood in every communion given, the Christ their forefathers hanged on that cross would've had to have been the size of a shorn mammoth, and they'd still have run out long ago!) -- remains, inchoate, inculcated into every child in Sunday school in any church that offers, requires or promotes communion, Catholic or Protestant, mainstream or evangelical. "Faith is the belief in things not seen."

Santeria bears a tangential similarity to the sacrifices demanded in the Torah -- firstborn, pair of doves, etc. -- but the Torah and the Bible leave out the notion of reading the entrails to determine the supplicant's fate.

Michael Vick's athletic prowess, for which he received a substantially higher remuneration than is average for a black man in this society (or any other kind of man in this society with the exception of heads of state (CEOs of corporations behaving and being paid in that class) or entertainers (e.g. ball players, actors), never mind any woman in this society -- Halle Berry doesn't draw the same salary for a picture Denzel Washington does, and neither of them draw the sort of money Tom Cruise routinely turns down) is judged on his ability to "play football" despite his having "grown up" and reached an age where most men would be working at a year-round job and either contemplating marriage or raising children already.

If you look at football, e.g., from the "observer" perspective of an anthropologist instead of either from a participant or fan perspective, what you'll actually see is a religion based on human sacrifice -- blood, sweat, tears, broken bones, crippling injuries, sometimes death on the field -- to which for unaccountable reasons hundreds of thousands of Americans don't just expose but willingly, indeed forcefully, submit their children every fall, even when they know the kid is never going to make millions annually in the NFL or probably even get a college scholarship to play ball. Many see it as a rite of passage into adulthood, a necessary mark of maturity.

Football is ritualized, stylized, civilized "war," just as Christianity is ritualized, stylized, civilized "murder and cannibalism."

Neither of those statements will make me many friends, but both those statements are fact-based, not faith-based. Like my statement that the color of Michael Vick's skin is in no way an excuse for his abhorrent behavior and should not in any way by any one be used as a defense against the criminal acts he has admitted committing, those statements describing the subjects examined, in all three cases, stand.

If you want me to see a hero when I look at Michael Vick, it isn't going to happen. If you want me to see a downtrodden victim of a corrupt legal system in an unfair society, Michael Vick is not the poster boy you ought to offer me.

What I see when I look at this case is a group of men who thought it was okay to treat animals cruelly and force those animals to fight or kill each other for the men's entertainment, and for the men to win or lose money bet on the outcome of those fights.

I find this sickening, and I would not find it less so if the men were Hispanic or white or Oriental (and yes, I've seen cockfights at secret locations in West Texas, and dogfights in South Texas, where the "audiences" weren't just black men, and nor were the bettors).

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!-- Xan

then you understand Michael Vick is a sacrafice.

Unless of his own making, out of unadulterated ignorance and arrogance -- can't you see? He admitted guilt.
He was gambling. Remember the Black Sox and Pete Rose?
Remember this guy?

Why are you so sure that Michael Vick is an innocent victim?

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!-- Xan

just outta curiousity...

n/t

He was innocent. This is simply unjust, I have no problem with his prosecution on gambling. The near hysteria surrounding this is, to me, extreame and unreal. The level of vitriol being hurled at his man is disturbing.

"That guy" is not getting this kind of hypocritcal coverage. He is not being called evil, a monster, a murderer.

You can call him a criminal. But to question his humanity? There isn't a soul in America that has that right, with what we do, how this country came to be, how we eat? No one has a right to question his humanity. Not for this. Any of it.

Until Human beings get involved, no.

Yeah, yeah, yeah - dogs are cute and precious, blah, blah, blah. PETA, PETA, PETA - puppy dogs, rainbows and unicorns…

Michael Vick didn’t kill a human; they were f@cking dogs - case closed. There have been countless examples of athletes responsible for deaths - Ray Lewis barely avoided murder charges - let alone drunk driving or worse (let’s not even discuss child support).

Now, it has been a long time since junior high but when last I checked, not only were dogs domesticated animals (that fall much lower on the food chain than humans) but we have killed domesticated animals for much lesser crimes. The ASPCA kills tens of thousands of domesticated animals on a weekly basis. Also, when in the hell did PETA become a lobby group in charge of upholding federal policy?

Don’t get me wrong - Pamela Anderson has great tits, but she needs to shut the f@ck up and just sit there and look pretty. Doesn’t she still have hepatitis or AIDS or something she caught from Kid Rock? Go get therapy bitch, and leave Michael Vick alone.

I agree that killing animals for random reasons is cruel; but fine him. Community Service. Any other mundane nonsense that we normally throw at bullsh!t crimes is the categorical reprimand this deserves.

He was making $100M. Can you imagine the good he would have been able to do in the furthering of animals’ rights with his fame and money? Am I on crazy pills or am I the only one who sees this as another step in the wussification of the public perception of justice? Michael Vick should be free - fine him, spank him, cane him, WHATEVER - but jail? WTF! Anyone who thinks this is enough to completely ruin a man’s life, is bat shit insane and should be spayed and neutered because they shouldn’t taint the gene pool.

Michael Vick’s contribution to the game of football is enormously more valuable than the lives of 10,000 dogs and 72 kittens.

I have spoken.

http://coedmagazine.com/sports/1986

for closing West Point...in case another were needed.
chuy, que marron!

pinche cabron, pendejo.
And you're stupid, too.

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!-- Xan

"Do you seriously wish to equate dogfighting with religion?"

Dogfighting abuses vulnerable innocents and causes horrific bloodshed. I can't imagine how that could be equated with religion.

(Note to Lambert: those are white football players)

Would it play out differently?

It would, of course, be possible for a flawed man to be justly accused yet unjustly sacrificed by evil people claiming to do good while dealing in profit, and all cheered on by the ignorant.

Eh?

We. Are. Going. To. Die. We must restore hope in the world. We must bring forth a new way of living that can sustain the world. Or else it is not just us who will die but everyone. What have we got to lose? Go forth and Fight!—Xan

uck...
Nobody participating in such sadistic, vicious acts should be immune from reproach, whatsoever form it takes...

Sacrificed to what, pray tell?
Vick would be above reproach if he had refrained from his sick, vicious, sadistic avocations.

Justice would be blind to color as well as winning records.

I've heard an argument that dogfight=sport is a "cultural" thing and that accepting dogfighting is part of "black culture."

That's bogus.

Maybe it's supposed to be a rebellion against dogs being used by slaveowners (and or prison wardens) to track down fugitives in the South of generations ago. Maybe it's a "see how tough my dog is?" macho bit of craptacularity (NB this appears to be the primary reason for fighting roosters' popularity) gone wild, or maybe it's some kind of "outlaw" romance gone craptacular.

Like the notion that driving caltrops into trees can save forests, the notion that making a dog vicious emboldens your personal manhood is a fallacy == and a dangerous one at that. If you need emboldenment, take krav maga lessons. Leave the dogs, who only want to be friends or herd sheep, out of it.