Obama wisely waits until January to press for unemployed, cites opposition, busy campaign schedule

Priorities, priorities:

After the Senate approved the $700 billion bank bailout, the majority leader, Harry Reid, tried to persuade his colleagues to address another economic calamity before they left town for the long election recess. He urged them to extend unemployment benefits for 800,000 jobless Americans.

In the face of Republican opposition, the measure failed. Benefits start expiring this week. So much for Main Street.

Look, I don't want to be saying "mean things," so I'll just ask a question:

If Obama doesn't see any reason to extend unemployment benefits before an election, why is there any reason to think he'll do better after the election?

Couldn't he have whipped his colleagues on that vote too, like he did for the trillion dollars going to Hank Paulson's golfing buddies?

Comments

It couldn't be in the bailout?

Thanks, jobless Americans, for keeping Wall Street rich! After all, what's more important--feeding your family or having an extra 10 million dollars?!
And-and-and the pork! Wooden arrows for little children! The little wooden arrow girl can now be safely hungry in the street.
Congress has its own security firmly in mind. Why not vote against everybody in office, except those few nay votes?

You Are Aware That A Stimulus Bill Extending Benefits

...was defeated only a week or so ago - maybe two weeks. Right before the Paulson bailout panic hit?

They can't pass anything like that because they need sixty votes in the Senate and Democrats only have 51 votes if every Democrat and Lieberman votes with them.

I will be very surprised if Democrats don't address that issue in January; in fact, I think a stimulus package will be one of the first orders of business for both congress and an Obama administration.

Your question is meaningless, Lambert, because it's based on no facts, no information about what the specific circumstances of this particular situation were.

You do understand that Obama is running for President, and that his campaign has a schedule laid out that isn't easily changed, without disappointing thousands of people at various venues, not to mention the local party.

If there was a chance in hell of passing the damn thing and having a veto-proof majority, I'd agree with you that every Democrat had a responsibility to stay there and pass it. But that is not the case.

And your snarky headline assumes facts not in evidence, i.e., that the non-passage of an extension of unemployment benefits, something that the Democrats included in their first stimulus package way back when in 2008, but were forced to drop to get any kind of package through, is the fault or failure of Obama.

The reflexive hostility to Obama keeps you from consideing what might be done to bring Democrats back after the election but before January to see if they can pass even a temporary extension.

As someone who was partly raised on unemployment benefits - Hollywood has an ugly habit of laying off its workers between productions, and nowhere was that truer than at the Disney studio, I understand exactly what is at stake for families. And my mother worked full time during the entirety of my childhood, and even so, unemployment benefits kept us from sliding back as a family. It meant I could still have my dance lessons, and my parents could still pay for daycare for my younger brother, so that my mother could continue to work. When they had finally saved up enough to put a down payment on a house, unemployment benefits insured that we didn't lose that house, even when layoffs lasted for months.

Given the kind of support Obama is receiving from unions, I'm quite sure he also understands what is at stake.

Who cares?

As I said:

If Obama doesn’t see any reason to extend unemployment benefits before an election, why is there any reason to think he’ll do better after the election?

Your comment speaks to legislative possibities; mine spoke to political advantage. (Perhaps I should have said "push for extending" instead of "extend"; I had his whipping the caucus for Paulson, instead of for the unemployed, in mind.)

As for the "reflexive hostility" straw man... Well, can I get an answer to the question posed here?

As for the unions... Perhaps they feel they have no place to go?

Finally, as to the "campaign schedule" point... Well, as I said, again: Priorities. Thanks for making my point so forcefully.

NOTE I revised the headline from "Thanks Obama" to reflect the material in your comment. I'm afraid that reality is biased toward snark....

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

Everything will be fine once Obama is president

That's a "fact", silly Lambert. We *know* Obama will do everything we want him to once he is president. Nothing he says or does (or fails to) matters. Get your "facts" straight. Once you do that you'll be happy that he stole an election, too!

Priorities first

"You do understand that Obama is running for President, and that his campaign has a schedule laid out that isn’t easily changed, without disappointing thousands of people at various venues, not to mention the local party."

That is exactly what is important and has been for three years....running for president. Governing or learning how too, oh....that is just too common. Me first.

Obama has a full-time job, ElizabethF

He's running for the presidency, and as Leah said he has in that role a massive complex of obligations that cannot be easily rearranged. His already staggering responsibilities not withstanding, Obama led on this unemployment extension effort as discussed here. It was sponsored by Jack Reed becasue it should logically come from his committee and because he was the lead sponsor on the previous benefits extension effort. This is Reed's turf, his expertise and his knowledge that was specifically applied, as it should be, and Obama along with many other Democrats lent their power and prestige as originating co-sponsors. He's done everything here he could reasonably be expected to do.

As to his ego, that will be a primary requirement; show me a politician without an oversized ego and I'll show you one who will not be President of the PTA, much less the United States of America.

I hear you

however, we are a country in crisis unlike anything ever experienced in many generations. This country may crash from a lack of leadership in government.

If you really think Obama's full time job is campaigning and he has no obligation to speak up for people he wants to represent about their survival when a bill is being passed contrary to it, I would say that is completely dismissive of what leadership is about.

This country needs every voice who passionately believes in fighting for the middle class. Every strong, coherent, passionate voice needs to be heard..loud, clear and immediate, not in a campaign speech in Zanesville, Ohio.

Speaking for me only

We have so much to be thankful for

Why quibble?..

The bailout bill also gives the Internal Revenue Service new authority to conduct undercover operations. It would immunize the IRS from a passel of federal laws, including permitting IRS agents to run businesses for an extended sting operation, to open their own personal bank accounts with U.S. tax dollars, and so on. (Think IRS agents posing as accountants or tax preparers and saying, "I'm not sure if that deduction is entirely legal, but it'll save you $1,000. Want to take it?") That section had expired as of January 1, 2008, and would now be renewed.

Starting with the so-called Anti-Drug Abuse Act in 1988, the IRS has possessed this authority temporarily, with occasional multiple-year lapses. A 1999 internal report said the IRS had 126 "trained undercover agents" working in field offices at the time. This is the first time that such undercover authority would be made permanent.

Obama is the gift that keeps on giving. And it isn't even Christmas yet. That doesn't arrive until January 20.

Clever title

Very concise as well

But isn't that how Congress works?

Some in Congress want something and others want other things--so couldn't the Dems tie the extended benefits in there too once the GOPers got on board because of the pork?
Did the Dems try this in the bail-out and I missed it? (450 pages...) Did they try and fail in the end? If they seriously tried again, because this bail-out would be a big opportunity, that would be a good sign.

Look, the wooden arrows got taken care of

Whaddaya want? Let's be reasonable, here, people.

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

they said originally it should be in, but isn't--

i don't know if it was in the first House version, or just was bullshit all along.

It was never in the Senate version at all.

Not only does he wisely wait

but cleverly, too. Don't ever show your hand too soon, say I.

Showing his hand

This early enough for you?

Obama Joins Reed, Senators to Introduce
Bill to Extend Unemployment Insurance

Wednesday, September 17, 2008
For Immediate Release

They should have held out for the aluminum arrows

We're talking the Boy Scouts here, after all. But, of course, one understands the need remain frugal in these trying times.

Obama lead advocacy of this unemployment benefits extension

Barack Obama co-sponsored a bill this past September specifically to extend unemployment benefits by seven to thirteen weeks and provide supplemental funding to depleted state unemployment programs. This bill is the one you discussed, the one that Harry Reid tried to usher to the floor but failed due to Republican opposition. Quite opposite your assertion, Lambert, Obama didn’t merely whip the effort - he co-sponsored the bill.

Obama, along with other senior Democratic leaders, put all of his influence on the line; unfortunately, the effort by the Democrats was inadequate. Those at fault here are the BlueDog caucus controlled by Steny Hoyer and the Republican House and Senate caucuses controlled by the Republican Party Criminal Conspiracy. Currently, neither Obama alone nor in combination with Pelosi and Reid has sufficient influence with those groups to gain the necessary support on this matter.

There’s a complicated history here, none of it Obama’s fault. The short version is that a pissing contest is going on between the Republican caucuses and the BlueDogs over two divergent economic-stimulus-special-interest-giveaway packages. They’ve been at it for weeks, and had the Trillion Dollar Rip-off Scam not appeared they would likely have sorted out the problems and all might have been quietly settled. The earlier, on-going argument got caught up in the Trillion Dollar Rip-off frenzy, the combination contributed to the vehemence of the larger argument, and in the end an extension of unemployment benefits was sacrificed by a compromise between the three caucuses. That coalition is, at the moment, to strong for Obama to overcome.

And now we get to the irony; I like irony, don’t you?

The Democrats engineered a 13-week unemployment benefit extension three months ago, as a package with the Fiscal Year 2008 supplemental appropriations bill. By itself it had no chance and a veto had been threatened anyway, but some hors-trading maneuvers by Reid got enough votes to tack it on as an amendment and Bush signed it after threatening a veto. This new extension, S.3507, presented in this bill as well as in other forms by the Democrats, is intended to go on top of the previous 13 weeks extension and is part of a package of direct citizen economic stimulus support that got caught up in the Republican-BlueDog argument and is currently stalled by that conflict.

The only way for Obama to gain the power to break the obstructive linkage of this three-caucus coalition is if he is elected President.

However the election turns out, the residual Republican Senate caucus will be large enough to still be obstructive; Dems will pick up six seats and maybe eight, but that’s all. Under a McCain administration that caucus will be protected by the Executive’s authority in the appropriations and disbursement process, and work with him as they have with Bush to drive the Executive’s will and thwart even simple human dignity measures like this unemployment extension.

Under a President Obama, however, the Democratic Caucuses will be in alliance with the Executive and the Republicans will be at their mercy. Only those Republican Senators who reach across in “bipartisanship” – the meme Obama and the Democrats have been pushing – will find them selves benefitting from the appropriations process. Those who stay in opposition will be frozen out. The Dems will need only two to four votes for cloture, and the line of suddenly “bipartisan” Republicans vying to be among them will, ahem, form to the Left.

There will almost certainly be a lame duck session, an end-of-session, post-election distribution of spoils and the rare opportunity for a good many consequence-free votes to be bought and sold. The President-elect will have enormous power over how the goodies get distributed and that means enormous power over which bills are advanced and which are not. If it is important to you to see Barack Obama’s unemployment benefits extension package enacted into law, then logically you should support his candidacy.

Could this be the reason you’ve been searching for, Lambert; the one you needed to be able to re-tick that checkbox “[X] Very tepidly voting for Obama”?

he did not whip it or work for it at all--

how many times should i post this about his "co-sponsoring" of things before you realize he does nothing?

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/con... -- "... "Hey, guys, can I come along?" And when Obama went before the microphones, he was generous with his list of senators to congratulate -- a list that included himself.

"I want to cite Lindsey Graham, Sam Brownback, Mel Martinez, Ken Salazar, myself, Dick Durbin, Joe Lieberman . . . who've actually had to wake up early to try to hammer this stuff out," he said.

To Senate staff members, who had been arriving for 7 a.m. negotiating sessions for weeks, it was a galling moment. Those morning sessions had attracted just three to four senators a side, Sen. Arlen Specter (R-Pa.) recalled, each deeply involved in the issue. Obama was not one of them. ..."

He did work to pass this horrendous bailout tho--wonder why?

Yeppers!

Delivering is not the same as advocating. Unfortunately for us all. And co-sponsorship is a rather cost-free form of advocacy -- particularly when you don't work the phones for it on your actual full-time job, the one you've already been elected to do. Working the phones for the bankers? No problemo!

So, the unemployed are under the bus with no benefits. But the wooden arrow makers are definitely on the bus! Nice to see the Senate -- and Senator Obama -- have their priorities clearly in order.

UPDATE 1 Of course, I agree that Obama, as party leader, must bow to the legislative calendar and the Blue Dogs, and hence has no leverage to use for this particular purpose. Which is a shame, since there's actually substantive matter in the bailout on mental health parity; it's not all wooden arrows. But then, as bringiton points out, the unemployed can perfectly well wait through the winter and the holidays for Congress to take their concerns up again. It's warm under the bus! I like it here!

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

How many times?

Repetition absent any proof is never sufficient to establish a case, nor is the repetition of diversionary claims with no applicability to the matter at hand. This is S.3507 under discussion, a bill that Obama originally co-sponsored, and you have provided no evidence to sustain your claim that he has failed to be as supportive of this measure as circumstances justify.

S.3507 failed in the Senate because of opposition by the Republican Caucus. At this time, Barack Obama has neither authority over nor substantive influence with the Republican Caucus; no reasonable, rational person would expect that to be the case.

All of the Senate Democratic Caucus and four Republican Senators would have supported the measure, but 55 votes was not enough to move it forward. There was absolutely nothing more that Obama could have done. No reasonable, rational person would expect that a candidate in the middle of a hotly contested presidential campaign should take time away to squander it on a fruitless pursuit of Senate votes from officeholders of the opposition party.

In yet another of your incessant baseless ObamaBashings you try to hold him responsible for the sins of the Republican Party. You are, once again, in error and no amount of repetition or diversion will make your false claims true.

This reasonable

Rational person, just observed Obama do just ("should take time away to squander it on a fruitless pursuit of Senate votes from officeholders of the opposition party") that, and wonders why my wellbeing isn't as important to Obama.

And then remembers, I never donated money to Obama.

i can haz hillary nao?

More information please, Aeryl

Happy to discuss things with you, but I'll need more information to understand what "...do...just that...." might mean.

55 votes is more than enough--

the 60-vote thing is a crock of shit.

If they would have forced the Repubs to filibuster -- instead of always preemptively caving in to empty threats to do so -- it would have passed. They didn't even bother bringing it to a vote, yet every single piece of shit the Repubs wants goes to a vote no matter what.

Authoritarianism in the defense of liberty is not a vice?

However imperfectly, we still exist in a nation of laws and rules. It isn't acceptable to simply change them willy-nilly by brute force to suit the needs of the moment, nor is it automatically a "dodge" to assert that breaking the rules/laws is not an acceptable means of achieving an otherwise desireable end.

Failing to extend unemployment benefits is dispicable. The fault for the failure in this specific instance rests on the Republican Senate Caucus and no one else; the only way to have forced approval would have been through a unilateral diktat in an institution structured to prevent just such an occurrence. It isn't in anyone's best interest for Harry Reid or Nancy Pelosi or Barack Obama to try and assume dictatorial powers, ever, not in this instance or any other. To argue that the majority can dismiss the established rights of the minority whenever it wishes is a very dangerous position to take, and one that finds not support but outright rejection from me and, thankfully, many others.

If you are unhappy with this turn of events, as am I, then by all means castigate those who are to blame - the criminal conspiracy known as the Republican Party and the citizens who put Republicans into office. By focusing your ire and placing the blame on those who are not at fault you remove pressure from those who are. Faulty logic leads to bad politics, every time.

And if you're unhappy with the way our government functions overall, please join me in the effort to rewrite the Constitution so that government will be more responsive to the needs of a modern citizenry.

Amazing.

Only those Republican Senators who reach across in “bipartisanship” – the meme Obama and the Democrats have been pushing – will find them selves benefitting from the appropriations process. Those who stay in opposition will be frozen out.

So the republicans will give up.

Just like that.

Amazing.

No, they'll be bought

There is a difference.

Yeppers? No, Lambert, not at all

In your zeal to castigate Obama, you published this post apparently without even a cursory search for mitigating information. I am willing to assume it was just that, a failure to search for balance, rather than a willfully biased misrepresentation. However, since you continue to persist in misrepresenting the facts about both Senator Obama and have also misrepresented my own position, the motivation behind your argument is being forced to the front. I would much prefer to debate on facts and logical merits; insisting on misrepresenting the intentions as well as the acts of Obama and me in this matter as you have done, however, will if continued make such a civilized exchange impossible. I beg you to reconsider your approach.

You assert that Obama was insufficiently supportive of extending unemployment benefits, and that this claimed inadequacy is the result of a callous disregard on his part for the most vulnerable among us. Both claims are false and unsubstantiated. The facts of the matter are as follows:

July 2008: Maneuvering over the objections of the Republican House and Senate Caucuses and a threatened veto by the White House, Democrats including Obama forced passage and signing into law a measure to extend unemployment benefits by 13 weeks (PL 110-252).

Early September 2008: Democrats tried to advance bills containing a variety of grass-roots economic stimulus measures including $6 Billion for additional extension of unemployment benefits and support for depleted state unemployment programs (S.3604; HR.7110). These bills were defeated as a result of a power struggle between the Senate Republican Caucus on one side and the House Republican Caucus and the BlueDogs on the other. Even if the BlueDogs could have been brought into line, the dispute between the two Republican Caucuses was not something the Democratic leadership could have controlled and the unity of the Senate Republican Caucus was enough to block both measures.

End-September 2008: The House rejects the Trillion Dollar Rip-off, in part to try and extort from the Senate the provisions of HR.7110. During subsequent negotiations, the Senate insists on including most of the provisions of S.3604 along with those of HR.7110 but Senate Republicans will not agree to inclusion of an unemployment benefits extension even though 800,000 unemployed people will run out of financial support starting in October. That being the only remaining impediment, it is agreed that the Rip-off bill will move forward without the unemployment benefit extension, which then will be offered as a stand-alone measure immediately after the Rip-off bill is passed. S.3507 and H.6867, put together in the aftermath of the failure to pass H.7110 and S.3604 in the hopes of appending it to some other legislation, are to be the vehicles.

3 October, 2008: The Trillion Dollar Rip-off (HR.1424) passes in the House.

3 October, 2008 – one hour later: H.6867, an unemployment benefits extension package companion to S.3507, passes in the House by a veto-proof margin of 368 – 28.

3 October, 2008 – at the same time: Harry Reid, with the full backing of the Senate Democratic Caucus and support from four Republican Senators (Snow, Coleman, Specter, and Smith of Oregon), urges suspension of the Senate rules to allow S.3507 to come directly to the floor. He is informed by the Republican Leader McConnell that there will be enough Republican “Nay” votes to block suspension of the rules, and the measure is held in committee.

You have claimed that Obama’s efforts in favor of extending unemployment benefits were inadequate. This is a false assertion, unsupported by any evidence. The Democrats, including Obama, provided every possible support for unemployment benefits extension on repeated occasions. In the end, it was obstructionism from the Senate and House Republican caucuses that thwarted these attempts. In the last attempt, the Democratic Leadership certainly did whip their caucus to full support; it was Republican obstructionism that blocked the bill and Republicans alone who should receive the blame.

Your original laying of blame on Obama was misplaced. Your continued insistence on blaming Obama and the Democrats in general in the face of overwhelming evidence to the contrary is an unmitigated falsehood. It is especially troubling that you should insist on perpetuating an obvious false claim about Obama while you so meticulously defend the secessionist Dominionist Sarah Palin against any and all claims you deem even slightly questionable. Sauce for the goose, sauce for the gander; you should retract your false claims about Obama in this matter.

You have also now made false assertions about me. You wrote “as bringiton points out, the unemployed can perfectly well wait through the winter and the holidays for Congress to take their concerns up again” when in fact I made no such point. What I urged was entirely the opposite. What I urged was a mustering of support for passage of S.3507 during the lame-duck session which will begin on November 17, and I have already written to my representatives urging passage with a provision for retroactive payments to keep recipients current. You are completely unjustified in making such a false representation about my position.

Harry Reid has vowed to make another attempt to pass the bill then, and the additional influence that can be brought by a President-elect Obama would certainly assist that effort while a President-elect McCain would likely ensure its defeat. I ask again for your support in that effort, and await your direct response to that request.

You know what now needs doing here, Lambert, and I urge you to do it swiftly and completely. Please put this unfortunate event in the past.

"zeal to castigate Obama"

[I almost forgot to return to that little gem -- speaking of attacks on character and intellectual integrity about which some, apparently, are latterly so sensitive.]

Say, rather the zeal to defend working people (a growing subset of whom are unemployed), women, and those who need care (health and otherwise) from assault -- Everyone, that is, who was thrown under the bus by the Obama campaign and the Democrat Party in the course of the primary.

I demand no apology. I will merely note that, unlike some -- the unnamed yet "bold" mentioned here come immediately to mind -- I won't have to execute any embarrassing pivots on policy, or retract any instrumental bullshit*, after Obama is elected and it turns out he represents neither my values nor my interests; I'm holdng his feet to the fire right away, as I have been throughout.

NOTE * Let alone try to self-medicate my own cognitive dissonance by demanding that others Shut The Fuck Up, "get over it," or stop being (allegedly) childish.

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

IMO, being the Media Darling

All Obama would have to do, would be to give a presser, shaming the Republicans for putting the bankers before the unemployed, and Voila! there would be the votes the bill needs.

But he can't even do that, and this is after he whipped this bailout bill(read around Corrente, it was well documented).

i can haz hillary nao?

More bloghorrea

Let's keep it simple.

Original points in post and scattered through comments:

1. Great contrast between Obama whipping caucus for the Bush + Reid + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson giveaway, not for unemployed. Subsidiary possibility: Making political hay out of Republican obstructionism. Neither happened. Co-sponsoring a bill is non-responsive, obviously. Priorities!

2. Great contrast between what got in the Bush + Reid + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson bill and what didn't. Originally, the wooden arrows (not the unemployed). Later, I find actual substantive material -- mental health in the bill (not, however, the unemployed). Priorities!

3. Simple conclusion: The unemployed -- unlike the bankers -- get thrown under the bus. And the party leader can't do anything about it. Priorities!

There's no point getting down in the weeds on the details of the legislative maneuvering; please refer to Shystee's post The Process Dodge, which cannot be improved upon, and file, circularly, as appropriate. Had help for the unemployed -- as opposed to the bankers -- been a priority, it would have happened, and perhaps even added as a Christmas tree ornament to the ush + Reid + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson bill. It wasn't; so it wasn't.

NOTE OK, I give one point. I revise this statement as follows:

As bringiton points out, the unemployed can perfectly well wait through until the winter and the holidays for Congress to take their concerns up again in a lame duck session

I wrote in haste, and I aplogize for the error.

That said, my original point on priorities remains; the unemployed can "perfectly well wait" while the Bush + Reid + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson bill shovels billions to the bankers.

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

Accepted

As far as it goes. Considered literally, with Obama as President-elect I expect the unemployment benefit extension to be wrapped up and sent to Bush by November 21 while Thanksgiving is not until November 27 and the first day of winter is December 21. The statement in its entirety was wrong, but I have no wish to nitpick; your apology is accepted, thank you for that and let us speak of it no more.

Regards Obama, in this matter you remain in error. I am more than comfortable with the correction I provided, apologize not in the least for taking the time and effort to present the whole truth, Process Dodge and accusations of bloghorrea be damned, and am more than satisfied that the Readers can at this point reach their own conclusions.

Once again, I commend The Process Dodge...

... to readers; it is a useful analytical tool.

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

What a bunch of baloney

Authoritarianism? To hold up the bill, hold press conferences, cajole, shame, and rail against obstructionist Republicans who are holding unemployment benefits hostage to get a "clean" (except for all the pork) Fat Cat Wall Street banker's bailout is now Authoritarianism?

Hyperboly has reached a new hyperbolic apex.

-----------------------------

Around these parts we call cucumber slices circle bites

What a brick of cheese

Democrats did all of those things, herb; apparently you failed to notice. Not widely covered by the press, especially in regards to the unemployment benefits package, so it would have been easy for someone not closely following to have missed them.

Here's the handout from the presser for S.3507, including statements of support by Reed, Obama, Kennedy, Baucus, Durbin, Stabenow and Whitehouse. No media coverage was given to it at all but then Republican blockage of unemployment benefits and other grass-roots economic stimulus measures is in fact just more-of-the-same news.

As the NYT article points out, both the Senate and House grass-roots based economic stimulus bills could not be passed on their own, due to Republican opposition and promised vetoes by Bush. The Trillion Dollar Rip-off Bill presented an opportunity to get the various measures enacted as amendments, and the Rip-off was in fact stalled by the House in part to give time for those negotiations to happen.

The Democrats were not about to block the Rip-off bill entirely, since they would now be getting the blame for every bad thing that is happening economically. Clever politics does not always mean good policy, but you straighten out the voters who keep electing Corporatist Republican and BlueDog hacks and then we'll talk about how Obama is the worst of the bunch.

Assume you haven't read the Rip-off bill or you would have seen that the Democrats were astoundingly successful at amending it with $150 Billion in direct economic benefits to citizens and worthy Progressive causes, including extension of the AMT exceptions for the middle-class, a mandate for mental-health parity in health insurance coverage that is wonderful all on its own and will help pave the way towards true comprehensive UHC, extension of business tax write-offs for R&D which are key to maintaining our national economic security, and billions for tax incentives supporting alternative renewable fuels R&D.

Everything but the unemployment benefits extension got packed in, and as Republican Senators refused to budge it got set aside so the rest of the deal didn't fall apart. This isn't a perfect process; getting 95% of what you want is considered a success. Your approach, employing the perfect as a weapon to destroy the good, has long been abandoned by modern Progressivism; do try to keep up.

The solution is more Democrats and fewer Republicans, especially in the White House and the Senate. If this Senate was 60D/40R, the unemployment benefits extension and a whole lot more good legislation would have been passed. Falsely accusing Obama and the Democrats for what is so clearly Republican obstructionism and heartless inhumanity will not change Republican behavior, and that is what needs to happen. You can beat on Obama all day long and it will not affect Republican conduct. What part of that is so difficult to understand?

Finally, regards the authoritarianism. What amberglow so clearly advocated was unilateral suspension of the Senate rules on debate, the so-called "nuclear option." Both parties agreed to these rules some time ago, and both are bound by them so long as honor and respect are part of the democratic process. Neither Harry Reid nor Barack Obama nor I are willing to throw honor and respect and mutual obligation to mutually agreed-upon rules out the window for a narrow objective. That some here would embrace such a foolish, self-destructive authoritarian course of action is disappointing but, sadly, not surprising.

Shovel?

Bringiton writes:

Neither Harry Reid nor Barack Obama nor I are willing to throw honor and respect and mutual obligation to mutually agreed-upon rules out the window for a narrow objective.

Well, except for the narrow objective of handing a trillion to Hank Paulson's golfing buddies, of course. Priorities!

Thanks for proving my point!

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

Re-read what I've written here, Lambert

including my prolix condemnations of the Rip-off bill and the politics that drove it.

Once again you are distorting my positions, but thanks for reading faithfully anyway.

Third time is the charm, perhaps

This is the third shift in justifications, unless I've lost count, and I have to admit it's the most robust so far. I'm very glad to see that the argument that Obama's busy campaign schedule was a priority, for example, has been quietly dropped. So, it's a pleasure to see that my (re)(per)sistence has finally yielded some benefits to the readers -- and perhaps even some tested talking points for Obama supporters!

The hilarious prating about Harry Reid's "honor" set me off, I do admit; I skipped to the end rather than plow through the prolixity.

The astounding benefits you claim for the Bush + Reid + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson bill were not listed when the text of the bill was made available on-line, as I noted at the time. I'll have to go look for them.

One question: Admit that everything you say is true, for the sake of the argument. My original point was the picture of Obama whipping the Ds for the bankers, and neither whipping the Ds for the unemployed, nor making any political capital on it. You respond by saying, in essence, that the Ds buffed the turd. Did Obama whip them to do that?

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

I'd say rather they sugar coated it

and yes, Obama was instrumental in pushing for the amendments. Funny you should ask; I'll have more to say over on the debate thread.

Wish you had pushed back again on the issue of Obama's schedule, perhaps I was not clear enough. The argument I tried to make, and not to speak for her but as I read the argument from leah, is a sound one; Obama couldn't sit in DC forever to argue this one issue; he had pushed for as much as he was going to get already, any more time spent would have been a waste because he wasn't going to get any more concessions.

The whole stunt by McCain of let's go to DC to sort the economic crisis was in part designed to pull Obama off the campaign trial, and Obama wisely didn't bite. He turned it back on McCain and well done, just from a political tactics standpoint.

One of the reasons the Dems went ahead and bought the deal, in addition to not wanting to take the full fall for the inevitable economic collapse, is that they need to get back out on the hustings. Republicans would be more than happy to have everyone trapped in DC right through until November, since they aren't able to raise any money and the more they have to face the voters directly the more they lose ground.

Your view of honor is not the same as Harry Reid's, to be sure. Mine is not exactly the same as his either. That doesn't keep me from seeing him as a basically honest and decent and honorable man, with whom I have disagreements. Oddly, or not, I feel the same way about you.

Oh, and I don't see this as a distinct argument, but rather a growing stack of sound arguments with increasing detail at each level. That said, I do appreciate you staying with it and driving towards greater clarity. We all benefit from sustained discussion and debate.

Well, I'd say they buffed a trillion dollar turd

Sugar coating is far too mild. The Bush + Read + Pelosi + Obama + Paulson bill is not a "bitter pill" to be minimized but the almost literal theft of people's livelihoods -- and, if life-saving programs like universal health care go down the tubes because of it, a lethal theft.

More word fog:

Obama couldn’t sit in DC forever to argue this one issue; he had pushed for as much as he was going to get already, any more time spent would have been a waste because he wasn’t going to get any more concessions.

Come on.

1. He was working the phones for the bankers. He didn't need to "sit in DC," forever or otherwise.

2. How do you know "he pushed for as much as he could get"?

3. How do you know "he wasn't goign to get any more concessions?"

Oh, wait. #2 is the same as #3 in different words. Sorry. There's the damn prolixity, the word fog again.

I understand the picture you are trying to paint of Obama's mad negotiation skills. And it's a pretty picture. However, at least in this thread, it's just not backed with anything but lots of soothing verbiage and no evidence at all. My question ("You respond by saying, in essence, that the Ds buffed the turd. Did Obama whip them to do that?") remains unanswered; somehow, someway the thread has shifted from Obama to the Ds generally.

So, I ask a question. But I don't get an answer. That keeps happening.

Re honor: Obviously, a person who could gut the Fourth Amendment and the rule of law by passing FISA [cough] reform has, to put it kindly, a sense of honor that is totally unfathomable to me.

[ ] Very tepidly voting for Obama [ ] ?????. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

Doing what I can

being of limited skills and prone to foggy thinking, and it is a tangled mess.

Part of the problem, and truly not to try and shift responsibility or obfuscate, is that I try to address one issue and somehow what I say gets applied to another issue where it may not fit. Maybe I'm not writing clearly, maybe you're reading too quickly; not sure, exactly, and not sure what to do about any of that in the moment.

The same kinds of challenges could be leveled at anyone trying to analyse from a distance, anyone who wasn't actually there. If that's a restriction, well, gonna get a little sparse around here. I make certain assumptions about people and speculate from there; you do the same, we all do in these kinds of things. You have a different set of base assumptions than I do, and that leads to differing interpretations of actions. Maybe that's where some of the communications difficulty comes from.

I didn't say Obama had mad skilz, I said he'd done as much as he could do and nobody could do any more, those being similar and complimentary limitations and that is why I introduced the whole of the Dem leadership into the conversation. Nobody could do any more, not the whole of the Dem leadership, although they had on multiple occasions advanced multiple bills to try and get the extensions. Why should Obama be the one tagged with failure to try?

Why do I say that everything posssible had been done? Because the companion bill, H.6867, passed 368 – 28. That big a margin happens when people have been worked over pretty good. If the Dem leadership, the BlueDogs and the House Rs hadn't whipped that wouldn't have happened. In the Senate though, the R's balked. Way too long inside baseball story why, sure wouldn't want to be prolix, but they did and that's that. Obama doesn't control the Senate Rs, does he?

If the Dems didn't care about the bill, why go to the trouble to whip the House to such a big margin? Why not just let it dribble through? Because they wanted to build a big enough margin that Bush wouldn't veto. The Senate Rs wouldn't play. Blame them, for hell's sakes, not Obama - to repeat, he doesn't control the Senate Rs.

As I've cited, and there are many more cites, the pattern since last spring has been the Dems bring bills to extend unemployment benefits and the Republicans block them. Over and over again. That's what happened here too. Somehow, you decided this time to blame Obama. I don't understand why, and I think you're wrong.

I think you failed to make your case that this is somehow all Obama's fault, in large measure by not including all the facts including Obama's co-sponsoring of S.3507 and the sequence of sausage-making events during the Trillion Dollar Rip-off. I don't know why that information wasn't included, but you are the one who left it out and you are the one who needs to provide an alternative explanation to the one I've posited. My explanation covers all of the available data, coherently and completely; yours falls well short.

The burden is on you here, not me; you made the flawed argument, and you need to sort it out.

Re honor: Nobody's a saint.

Superior much?

Dear BIO,

Re:

Assume you haven’t read the Rip-off bill or you would have seen that the Democrats were astoundingly successful at amending it with $150 Billion in direct economic benefits to citizens and worthy Progressive causes, [snip]

Your approach, employing the perfect as a weapon to destroy the good, has long been abandoned by modern Progressivism; do try to keep up.

Fuck off. Once again, when people point out something you don't like, you assume they don't know shit, and at the same time use squishy facts, reinforcing the fact that it is YOU who doesn't know shit.

I knew (and know) very well what was additionally loaded on to the bill. Some very good things indeed, in fact, since it is my business to know (and be profited by) it, I was especially pleased that they passed the billions in tax credits for wind and solar energy development not only "alternative renewable fuels R&D" which they also passed but in the millions, rather than billions. But the alt energy was going to pass previously with wide support in the energy bill that McCain killed, and the mental health provisions (the Wellstone bill) had wide bipartisan support and would have passed next year but friends of retiring Republican Jim Ramstad wanted desperately to pass it while he was still in office. Do try to keep up.

But all of that is red herring material isn't it? Because what we were talking about was unemployment compensation, another thing that if not extended causes already suffering people to suffer more and in real time. This isn't "the perfect as a weapon to destroy the good" (what a strawman that is!). They had a press conference that no one paid attention to (by design?), and though Obama had plenty of time to lobby for (and score political points on) the bill itself, he had apparently little time or inclination to fight for unemployment benefits, which quite frankly was more germaine than most of the other candy stuck on this turd.

But:
Much campaigning to do!
Can't be blamed for Bush's economic collapse (though unclear how a trillion to Wall Street will make it better, not worse), so must pass a shitty Trillion Dollar Ripoff!
Priorities!
The shitty over the less shitty!
Obama will help "do something" in January!
Past performance is not indication of....!
Welcome to your future!

-----------------------------

Around these parts we call cucumber slices circle bites

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