— http://thepage.time.com/pool-report-for-…

The DNC told those states their delegates wouldn’t be seated if they moved up their primaries. They moved up their primaries. Their delegates weren’t seated.

Common-sense party governing bearing the Hillary stamp of approval.

Yes, I know you’re all pretending that she wasn’t for it before she was against it. But unfortunately we have documents with her signature and stuff.

“Somebody forgot to tell Hillary Clinton the Democratic presidential race is over and Barack Obama won.” - Reuters, 3/27/08

about the disfranchisement of MI and FL. I still can’t figure out why Obama didn’t agree to it.

Six or eight weeks ago Obama would’ve done fine in those states and might have even won one of them — but not now. Heck, he’ll still probably pick up delegates compared to the current situation.

I can’t figure out what the brilliant tacticians in his camp are thinking.

I want a new president who will grab the VRWC by the throat and beat it senseless, strip it down until it is small enough to - what’s the phrase? - oh, yes; drown it in the bathtub.

Bringiton - Unfortunately Paul Wellstone is dead and no one will even admit there is a VRWC.

Do you mean like this?

Just like that. March right in and tick off the ways you’re going to crush him by the nuts. Look at the expression on his face. Not a happy man. Yes, just like that.

Mr. Hopey doesn’t frighten anyone, except the worst of the racists. The corporatists aren’t worried about him at all.

killing the rightwing haters with kindness—FOX, Murdoch, Drudge, Scaife, etc—they’ve actually been much less harsh on her than the “more respectable” MSNBC or CNN or the WaPo or NYT, etc.

And as Senator she had to deal with Murdoch and others because they need Senate/law stuff and FCC things, etc.

for fundraising, as convenient demons, etc…

they’d be lost without Clintons.

“… you have to remember that one of Liberalism’s virtues is that it is pragmatic not ideological or even idealistic. Liberalism is and has been about recognizing and adapting to, and when called for making corrections to, reality, that is to the world as it actually is and to people as they actually are. Most of Liberalism’s successes over time have required making people see what is really going on, as opposed to what they wish was going on or what they are being told by the ruling class is going on.

Liberalism is first and foremost an insistence on freeing people from their own deluded and demented thinking. It is a demand that people give up their prejudices and their vain and self-centered illusions and deal with the facts of life. …” — http://lancemannion.typepad.com/lance_ma…

Thanks for linking to it, amberglow.

[x] Any (D) in the general. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

Really, BIO? Is that how you characterize Sen. Clinton’s visit to the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review? Can’t say I’ve heard anything like your interpretation elsewhere, but I guess you can read faces better than most.

for damn sure. Pay attention to what I have to say, maybe you’ll learn something.

The photo was the kind I’d like to have seen the BAGnews people deconstruct. I’m not seeing the dominant white male billionaire there.

[x] Any (D) in the general. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

The point of the original post was this: Leaders lead, they don’t just talk about what their leadership would be like if they did lead.

Let’s forget the rights and wrongs of the FL/MI.

We were told, constantly, by the OFB (though perhaps the line was changed) that Obama’s mad negotiation skillz would bring about Universal Health Care, where Hillary’s putatively more confrontational approach would now.

OK, so are this skills at “bring[ing] people together to seek pragmatic solutions” at all in evidence in the FL/MI no-revote debacle? No, of course not. All Obama did was lawyer up and run out the clock and make absurd demands for votes that weren’t his to claim. In fact, are Obama’s skills in “bringing people together” at all in evidence anywhere in this campaign? I’d say no.

It’s not responsive to say, oh, Hillary is the problem, or oh, Hillary’s supporters would are crazed, or, “get over it, those are the rules.”

Because a leader who touts his negotiation skills and ability to bring people together is going to doing just that . Obama’s not.

My Unity Pony’s still on back order. Yours?

[x] Any (D) in the general. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

IMO, it is because they learned the lesson in New Hampshire. You can’t attack Clinton like they used to, it helps her.

They’ve been more balanced towards her, and I honestly think it would work in our favor in the GE.

I could swear that I read somewhere that Scaife feels remorse for what he did to the Clintons. That after watching the failings of Bush, he now realizes that President Clinton did a pretty good job.

regarding Florida and Michigan by getting out fron on the issue early, working to resolve the situation in a manner fair to everyone (including the voters) then the favorable publicity and goodwill he would have earned would have more than overcome any short-term political loss to Hillary.

The only thing that apparently matters to him is winning.

Mr. Hopey doesn’t frighten anyone, except the worst of the racists. The corporatists aren’t worried about him at all.

* reply

I’m sure Mark Penn’s client list is pissing themselves in fear of Sandy Weil’s candidate.

that Obama’s mad negotiation skillz would bring about Universal Health Care, where Hillary’s putatively more confrontational approach would now.

This is another example of you guys winning arguments with yourself. Hillary’s health plan record is one of bending over backward to make the health insurance industry happy. There is no reason to believe she has changed her tune.

You folks have created an entire delusionary world in which Senator DLC, the woman who brought Dick Morris in the the White House and voted for AUMF and the flag amendment, is a progressive crusader.

that’s the real shame of this whole thing—they’re both center-right.

no one thinks she’s progressive at all-neither of them are—

that’s the real shame of this whole thing—they’re both center-right.

Your title is wrong but your analysis of the two of them is right.

the same people who think he’s a liberal?

http://www.gallup.com/poll/105742/Democr…

It seems the same groups(Reagan Dems) are leaving regardless, just less of them with Clinton.

As I’ve stated, Obama has given me no reason to vote for him, which is interesting, b/c I entered this primary season with Obama as my second choice(Edwards first). But the more I saw of all of them, the more I liked Clinton and the less I liked Obama.

And I first saw Obama when he won the Democratic senate primary in Illinois, where after watching him speak, I said he was our generation’s JFK, MLK, and RFK, all rolled into one. And I said he would be a great candidate in 2008. Too bad he didn’t listen to me. He just hasn’t done enough yet.

seriously—who thinks she’s progressive?
new
Submitted by amberglow on Thu, 2008-03-27 23:18.

the same people who think he’s a liberal?

Much of the attacks on Obama here make even less sense than they appear to if you don’t think the authors believe Hillary is progressive.

You’ll do better that way, rootless, my advice.

[x] Any (D) in the general. [ ] Any mullah-sucking billionaire-teabagging torture-loving pus-encrusted spawn of Cthulhu, bless his (R) heart.

but he’s your boy; you encouraged him, you tend to him.

About Mrs. Clinton, he writes:

But the substance of her policy proposals on mortgages, like that of her health care plan, suggests a strong progressive sensibility.

I know he’s taken know end of ’incoming,’ and yet he sticks to his guns.

I think Obama lost him at ’Social Security is in Crisis.’ Or sumpin like that.

One thing that I think (even!) Atrios missed in Clinton’s remark about having Greenspan, Volcker and Rubin meet was that she proposed them b/c each one of those guys represents a supporter of McCain, Obama and Clinton, respectively. I still think it’s a silly idea to let those dudes anywhere near “the solution,” but still. It was an attempt at…unity! OMG!

Cheers,
GDK

Sorry. Bad spledding mistake, above. It’s “no end of incoming…”

I’m off to bed before I embarrass myself further ;)

Vanity Fair did a piece several months ago on Scaife and his nasty divorce. Scaife and Bill had lunch last year during which Bill mainly promoted his foundation’s AIDS work in Africa. Scaife apparently left the meeting with a signed copy of My Life, then later donated $100,000 to the Clinton Foundation. He also donated money to a local (Pittsburgh) AIDS group. Scaife was quoted by VF as saying “I never met such a charismatic man in my whole life.”

to the Vanity Fair piece that Imelda was quoting, above. It’s from the Feb 2008 issue.

Cheers,
GDK

comparison and contrast to Obama, not on her own—the majority of American people are to the left of her on all domestic issues, and more to the left of Obama, but neither really have progressive or liberal positions—they’re center-right.